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Tour de France, Stage 16 - Wednesday, Pau - Bagnères-de-Luchon
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| sutty68 |
Posted on 17-07-2012 11:27
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johannes-w wrote:
sutty68 wrote:
As the saying goes - The profile is like Sharks teeth 
So this should be a good day for the Shark of Messina then  I certainly hope so 
Yon never know
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| beagle |
Posted on 17-07-2012 11:40
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Pellizotti2 wrote:
I just hope to see Kessiakoff in the breakaway. If he manages to pick up major points atop Aubisque and Tourmalet I think it looks very good for him in the KoM classification.
No Rolland in the break, please.
I hope Kessiakoff won´t win polka dot jersey. I don´t want to see "best climber" sitting somewhere around 60th or 70th place overall again. Go Rolland!!!
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| fredinho |
Posted on 17-07-2012 11:42
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Lets hope that the saboteurs from the previous stage keeps the hell away from the decents, other than that, I really hope that the GC's (except wiggins) can work togheter and destroy Skys dominance!
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| kumazan |
Posted on 17-07-2012 11:48
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Pellizotti2 wrote:
No Rolland in the break, please.
Wiggins himself went to close the gap to Coppel because he was 14th in GC 11' down and Wiggins was afraid of him getting too much time back. No way they let Rolland go in the breakaway.
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| beagle |
Posted on 17-07-2012 11:54
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kumazan wrote:
Pellizotti2 wrote:
No Rolland in the break, please.
Wiggins himself went to close the gap to Coppel because he was 14th in GC 11' down and Wiggins was afraid of him getting too much time back. No way they let Rolland go in the breakaway.
question is if that was real reason maybe he just wanted to demonstrate his power after showing "weakness" in previous stage?!
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| kumazan |
Posted on 17-07-2012 12:00
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Still, even if Sky won't be bothered by Rolland, RadioTard will, because they love too much to get anonymous 7th-10th places in GC to lose it to a breakaway.
Edited by kumazan on 17-07-2012 12:01
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 17-07-2012 12:07
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beagle wrote:
Pellizotti2 wrote:
I just hope to see Kessiakoff in the breakaway. If he manages to pick up major points atop Aubisque and Tourmalet I think it looks very good for him in the KoM classification.
No Rolland in the break, please.
I hope Kessiakoff won´t win polka dot jersey. I don´t want to see "best climber" sitting somewhere around 60th or 70th place overall again. Go Rolland!!!
I agree. And we are not the only ones that dislike half-decent riders winning it... http://www.cycles...mpetition/
Edit: Well, the article is not about "quality" of riders,but about different aproach to Kom is needed...
Edited by Avin Wargunnson on 17-07-2012 12:12
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| alexkr00 |
Posted on 17-07-2012 12:25
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Only 2 kilometers of flat between the downhill section on the finish? This will be a great opportunity for Nibali to gain time back and I hope he won't miss it.
And about the polka dots. What beagle said. The winner should be someone that can actually climb with the best. So I'm cheering for Rolland too.
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| ShortsNL |
Posted on 17-07-2012 12:57
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Personally, I don't mind if the KoM jersey isn't in the GC top 10. I mean, the Green jersey isn't either. If the KoM jersey is in the top GC top 10, then the race has been too focused on mountains and summit finishes if you ask me. |
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| alexkr00 |
Posted on 17-07-2012 13:08
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Of course the green jersey isn't going to be in the top 10. After all it's the "spritners' jersey". If you are indeed the true "King of the Mountains" you should be able to get into the GC top 10.
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Posted on 25-05-2013 16:20
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 17-07-2012 13:17
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ShortsNL wrote:
Personally, I don't mind if the KoM jersey isn't in the GC top 10. I mean, the Green jersey isn't either. If the KoM jersey is in the top GC top 10, then the race has been too focused on mountains and summit finishes if you ask me.
Lol wut?
The green jersey should be for the rider who is best at stage finishing when you sum up all stages, that is pretty spotty with Sagan.
And polka dots should be for the best climber in the race,at least in my opinion. Not for the rider who was in two breaks and there he gained all the points...
Edited by Avin Wargunnson on 17-07-2012 13:22
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| beagle |
Posted on 17-07-2012 13:28
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Avin Wargunnson wrote:
ShortsNL wrote:
Personally, I don't mind if the KoM jersey isn't in the GC top 10. I mean, the Green jersey isn't either. If the KoM jersey is in the top GC top 10, then the race has been too focused on mountains and summit finishes if you ask me.
Lol wut?
The green jersey should be for the rider who is best at stage finishing when you sum up all stages, that is pretty spotty with Sagan.
And polka dots should be for the best climber in the race,at least in my opinion. Not for the rider who was in two breaks and there he gained all the early points...
..., cracked in penultimate climb and finished 20+ mins behind GC contenders.
btw thanks Avin for the link, interesting article
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| gotlandrules |
Posted on 17-07-2012 13:29
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Biggest problem is that none of the best climbers go for the polka jersey because their team is afraid to drop from 8th to 11th in GC and lose WT-points.
I agree that the KoM-competition has a really flawed system, but to say that Rolland is more worth it then Kessiakoff is just plain wrong. Rolland hasn't taken any points when climbing with the big boys, he took all his points from a breakaway too.
And we just don't know if Kessiakoff can climb with the best this years tour or not, he wasn't on form at the beginning because of his allergy-problems earlier in the spring and now he's ridden himself into form. But now all his focus is on the KoM jersey so he will only ride for that and won't even try to climb with the main group in the mountains, he will be in the breakaway or rest himself with the groupetto.
Edited by gotlandrules on 17-07-2012 13:30 |
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| gotlandrules |
Posted on 17-07-2012 13:31
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beagle wrote:
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
ShortsNL wrote:
Personally, I don't mind if the KoM jersey isn't in the GC top 10. I mean, the Green jersey isn't either. If the KoM jersey is in the top GC top 10, then the race has been too focused on mountains and summit finishes if you ask me.
Lol wut?
The green jersey should be for the rider who is best at stage finishing when you sum up all stages, that is pretty spotty with Sagan.
And polka dots should be for the best climber in the race,at least in my opinion. Not for the rider who was in two breaks and there he gained all the early points...
..., cracked in penultimate climb and finished 20+ mins behind GC contenders.
btw thanks Avin for the link, interesting article
He didn't crack though, he sat up in the downhill and gave up and rested for the next day. |
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| ShortsNL |
Posted on 17-07-2012 13:46
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Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Lol wut?
The green jersey should be for the rider who is best at stage finishing when you sum up all stages
Not really. The intermediate sprints for the green jersey wouldn't be there if what you are saying is true. The green jersey is there for the best flat/punchy sprinter who can also survive until Paris.
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
And polka dots should be for the best climber in the race,at least in my opinion. Not for the rider who was in two breaks and there he gained all the points...
I agree, but if the best climber is also in the top 10 of the GC, it means that the race profile is too climber-oriented in my opinion, with too many summit finishes etc. I'd rather see a race with less emphasis on climbs, and equal emphasis on cobbles/timetrialling/endurance. That way, the yellow jersey is truely for the best overall rider, and not just for the best climber who can also time trial, and the polka dot not just for the second in the GC who can't time trial as good. |
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| lluuiiggii |
Posted on 17-07-2012 13:49
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ShortsNL wrote:
I agree, but if the best climber is also in the top 10 of the GC, it means that the race profile is too climber-oriented in my opinion, with too many summit finishes etc. I'd rather see a race with less emphasis on climbs, and equal emphasis on cobbles/timetrialling/endurance. That way, the yellow jersey is truely for the best overall rider, and not just for the best climber who can also time trial, and the polka dot not just for the second in the GC who can't time trial as good.
If the best climber of a GT can't enter it's Top 10, then the route is more suited to time-trialists than last year's Paris Nice.
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| ShortsNL |
Posted on 17-07-2012 13:53
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lluuiiggii wrote:
[quote]ShortsNL wrote:
If the best climber of a GT can't enter it's Top 10, then the route is more suited to time-trialists than last year's Paris Nice.
I don't mind if the best climber of a GT can enter the GC top 10, if it's his choice to go after the GC and not the mountain classification. But if the KoM-jersey wearer is also in the GC top 10, why even bother having a seperate KoM classification? The mountain and general classifications would be practically identical... |
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 17-07-2012 13:56
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ShortsNL wrote:
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Lol wut?
The green jersey should be for the rider who is best at stage finishing when you sum up all stages
Not really. The intermediate sprints for the green jersey wouldn't be there if what you are saying is true. The green jersey is there for the best flat/punchy sprinter who can also survive until Paris.
Well Sagan would win it/lead it even when it would be only about stage finishes and examples from the past few years points this competition is okay as it is, with best sprinters winning it (not only these who can sprint on the pan flat, some climbing ability is needed just to ride to Paris and grab points also in the sprints in hilly stages).
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
And polka dots should be for the best climber in the race,at least in my opinion. Not for the rider who was in two breaks and there he gained all the points...
I agree, but if the best climber is also in the top 10 of the GC, it means that the race profile is too climber-oriented in my opinion, with too many summit finishes etc. I'd rather see a race with less emphasis on climbs, and equal emphasis on cobbles/timetrialling/endurance. That way, the yellow jersey is truely for the best overall rider, and not just for the best climber who can also time trial, and the polka dot not just for the second in the GC who can't time trial as good.
I agree with luuiiggii here...
Edited by Avin Wargunnson on 17-07-2012 14:39
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| kumazan |
Posted on 17-07-2012 13:56
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No. Even in the stupidly pro-GC biased KoM classification of last year's Tour, the KoM winner was S.Sánchez who was nowhere near the podium. The solution for this is pretty simple, the KoM should give more UCI points than a 4th place in GC. DO that, and you won't see average climbers like Roche, Zubeldia et al hanging on for dear life just to get a lame 9th place in GC.
Edit: And yes, nowhere near the podium is an exaggeration, but hopefully you'll get the point.
Edited by kumazan on 17-07-2012 13:58
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 17-07-2012 13:57
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kumazan wrote:
No. Even in the stupidly pro-GC biased KoM classification of last year's Tour, the KoM winner was S.Sánchez who was nowhere near the podium. The solution for this is pretty simple, the KoM should give more UCI points than a 4th place in GC. DO that, and you won't see average climbers like Roche, Zubeldia et al hanging on for dear life just to get a lame 9th place in GC.
This, cant agree more...
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